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Month: February 2021

Internationalism begins at home

How Right to the City is connecting a local campaign to international activists


22/02/2021

This week, a good activist sent the following message to the DSA Berlin mailing list:

“So far I have noticed a major contrast between willingness to talk about ‘international solidarity’ and willingness to actually do it. When I invite a lot of activists or organisations to the meetings, they’re too busy with their local issues. I get it, I am in DW Enteignen too and I see that people are really busy with it. But surely there must be some time to come.

Heck, I even have the impression that my link to the open letter falls on deaf ears, even though it only takes a minute or two to read and sign it”

The context here was an attempt to build support for “Rentvolution“, a campaign to link right-to-housing movements and activists throughout Europe. I think that these are serious points that need addressing, although I disagree with some of the premises. This article tries to explain why.

Signing petitions is not enough in days like these

I’m not someone who regularly signs petitions and open letters, precisely because they only take a minute or two to read and sign. Appeals to the rich and the powerful to see the error of their ways largely fall upon deaf ears.

This is not to say that petitions are worthless. I have fond memories of my first wave of activism in the 1980s, asking people to sign against apartheid South Africa or attacks on abortion rights. The point though was to engage people in conversation about how they could support and get actively involved in current campaigns.

More recently, in a short period of time, 100,000 people in Germany have signed the Zero Covid petition. This is significant as it has shifted the terms of a debate which has been dominated for a year by supporters of the Merkel government (despite its preference for profits over people’s lives) or by a strange cabal of conspiracy theorists and right wing extremists who have organised the most visible opposition to Merkel.

Suddenly there was a palpable left-wing opposition to the government’s Covid policy, which was in the public consciousness mainly because of the number of people who had signed the Zero Covid petition. This is a basis for getting people involved in a much more lasting campaign.

Yet without an accompanying campaign, signing petitions can become a form of virtue signalling, which makes the signatory feel good, but does nothing to change the balance of forces and allows things to carry on as they are. In these circumstances, we can understand why many people are reluctant to sign on.

What does this mean for us now?

To be fair to the Rentvolution open letter, it is more than just an appeal to the Great and a Good, but a call for action on 27th March. I really hope that it will result in serious actions, but such actions are built by activists on the ground.

Now I have my doubts about this particular campaign, but that’s for a different article. Experience has shown that international networking can strengthen local campaigns. In Berlin, the most significant anti-gentrification campaign is Deutsche Wohnen & Co Enteignen (DWE). It is only right that DWE works together with all credible international campaigns.

But what does international networking mean in practice? While it is important to send delegates to international meetings, it would be a great error for all local activists to concentrate on these meetings at the expense of building something on the ground at home. We may learn things from our international compatriots but we can effect most change where we are.

DWE is currently organising a referendum in Berlin to “expropriate the big landlords“. If successful, it could have international ramifications. But this success depends on us all convincing our friends, workmates and random people on the streets to vote in the referendum, and to ensure that they also actively build the campaign.

The original post worries that being “too busy with their local issues” gets in the way of international solidarity. I would argue the reverse. If we win in Berlin, housing campaigners from Brooklyn to Barcelona, from Rio to New Delhi will see that it is possible to resist a rampant neo-liberal housing policy. We can then go to international networking meetings, not just to share hopes that the world could be better but to relate experiences of how this can be done.

International Networking

One of the few positive by-products of globalisation is that social movements have become more international. From Extinction Rebellion to Black Lives Matter, campaigns which started in one country have inspired people worldwide and resulted in similar campaigns being formed in other countries.

This international proliferation of activism has created a need for more cross-border networking, where we can share best practises and learn from the successes and failures of campaigns elsewhere. This is something that we saw in genesis in the first World and European Social Forums around the turn of the Century.

I remember being at the European Social Forum (ESF) in Paris in 2003 with a large delegation from Southern Germany. For many people it was the first time that they had been on a demonstration where there was a large block of white activists carrying Palestine flags. This prompted an important debate in a country that has been resistant and often hostile to Palestine solidarity.

Even more significant was the first ESF in Florence in November 2002. This was held in the shadow of imminent war with Iraq. One evening, a few hundred activists came together to plan what was to become the largest ever international demonstration – the anti-war demos around 15 February 2003.

I doubt that 15 February would have had the same character without this spontaneous meeting in Florence. Yet what was important was not just that a group of international activists came together, but that they represented something. I was there with a group of people from ATTAC Germany’s Globalisierung und Krieg (Globalisation and War) group, but there were also leading members of Britain’s Stop the War Coalition and equivalent organisations throughout Europe.

In the 3 months between Florence and the international mobilisation, we went back home and organised things. In Germany, the Globalisierung und Krieg group organised an international speakers’ tour which attracted thousands of people. In Stuttgart, where I was living, 400 people packed into the trade union hall. On 15 February, 20 buses made the 400 mile journey to the demonstration in Berlin, despite 50,000 demonstrating on the same day in Stuttgart.

None of this would have been possible if we hadn’t spent the previous years patiently building organisations at home – the trade unions who hosted the event and helped provide buses, the peace movement activists and of course ATTAC, who were able to mobilise their members and provide a pole of attraction to the people who were sickened by the threat of war and wanted to do something to prevent it.

Right to the CIty

One important part of DWE is the Right to the City group, which tries to involve the 25% of Berlin’s citizens who do not have a German passport. Although non-Germans are not even allowed to vote in the referendum, so far Right to the City has been remarkably successful in mobilizing dozens, maybe hundreds, of international activists.

Berlin is full of exile political organisations. Co-Liberation and Dziewuchy Berlin raise solidarity for the victims of abortion laws in Poland, Berlin for India organise demos in solidarity with the mass actions by Indian farmers. Similarly, Labour Berlin and Berlin for Bernie (now DSA Berlin) made significant contributions to the election campaigns of Jeremy Corbyn and Bernie Sanders.

These are all important organisations, and you can find out more about many similar campaigns on our Campaign of the Week page. Yet Right to the City is slightly different. The international nature of the group is important, but what is most important is that the main focus of activity is in Berlin. Exile organisations focussing on their “home” country can only involve some of these people for some of the time. All international activists in Berlin have both a stake in lower rents and the power to change things.

8 years ago, we set up the LINKE working group “Internationals” as an attempt to overcome some of the problems that activists in a foreign country encounter. The idea was to involve Berlin’s international community in German politics, but also to show the German Left that they have a wealth of experienced activists living in their cities. I see Right to the City as being in a similar tradition and am actively involved in the campaign. There is information at the bottom of this article about how you can get involved.

Only last week, I interviewed Hossam el-Hamalawy, the Egyptian journalist and activist about the leading role that he played in the so-called “Arab Spring” 10 years ago. I finished the interview with the obligatory question: “What is the best way in which people in the Global North can support the struggles in Egypt and make your fight our fight?”

Hossam’s answer was revelatory: “Pressure your governments into ceasing the arms exports and security cooperation with the Egyptian and autocratic regimes. Help spread the word about the abuses of the Egyptian regime, and actively lobby for the release of the detainees. And last but not least: Get active locally. It’s a global system of oppression, and we need to bring it down, in Cairo or Berlin.”

True internationalism lies in bringing people of all countries together in joint activity where they are. This will involve at some points signing petitions and attending international meetings, but it will also involve lots of unseen work in our own communities. So, yes, let’s please come together and discuss what is strategically necessary to build our campaigns, but don’t think that internationalism is only something that we do somewhere else.

What does this mean practically?

Let’s briefly return to the post that provoked this article. It can indeed be frustrating to feel that other people are not being as active as they could. This feeling is even stronger in times of Covid, when social interaction is limited. Isolation can mean that our righteous anger is atomised. The first reply to this is that most people have families, work and the need to occasionally have fun. We make the political work that we can in the time that is available to us.

Activity can also not be judged solely by counting the number of people on demonstrations. There is also the need for strategic discussion. Given that we don’t have the time to do everything, where should we concentrate our energies? This requires both individual and collective decisions. I may find one particular campaign more exciting, but often it’s better to get involved in larger and broader campaigns which have the social weight to change things. Sometimes the right political decision lies in choosing what not to do.

The reason why specific moments like 15 February 2003 are so well attended is because they attract participation that goes way beyond the activist community – people became active not just because of a sense of duty or political commitment, but because they really thought that their actions could have concrete results. It is much easier to convince someone to get involved when they think that what they are doing can change society.

The anti-gentrification campaign in Berlin has reached such a historic moment that has the potential to result in real change. We can win this one if we fight together.

Phil Butland is the speaker and founder member of the LINKE Berlin Internationals. For more information about activities of the group, send a mail to lag.internationals@die-linke-berlin.de.

Right to the City meets online every second Wednesday at 7pm. The next meetings are on 24th February and 10th March. For an invitation to the meetings, send a mail to right2thecity@dwenteignen.de.

On Monday, 15th March at 7pm, the Berlin LINKE Internationals are organising a public meeting Gentrification: are non-Germans to blame? And how can we expropriate the big landlords together? with Joanna Kusiak (Deutsche Wohnen & Co. Enteignen), Karen Nafersky (housing activist in Brooklyn) and Hülya Kilic (housing activist in Kreuzberg) . The meeting will be livestreamed at theleftberlin.com where you can send questions to the speakers.

“When the tide changes in the future, we will be ready”

Interview with Egyptian journalist and activist Hossam el-Hamalawy


21/02/2021

Hi Hossam, thanks for taking the time to speak to us at a time which must be very busy for you.

Let’s start with why you’re busy. This month sees the tenth anniversary of the so-called “Arab Spring”. How accurate is this term to describe what happened in February 2011?

I personally use the term just out of convenience, because everyone uses it, and the international media popularized it. Alternatively, I sometimes refer to the events as “regional uprisings,” or “first wave of revolutions.” However, I do agree the term is a bit controversial because not all participants in the uprisings were “Arabs”–for example, the Kurds, Berbers and Nubians. Even more, Arab nationalism in the past was a tool of oppression for some of those communities. Also the term “Spring” may cause some sensitivities, since the term previously was usually associated with the US-backed dissident movements in the former Stalinist countries.

However, it would be impossible to come up with one term that makes everyone happy.

My next question is fairly personal. I’ve read a lot of articles and interviews that you’ve written and even interviewed you myself a couple of times. What is missing from most of these is a summary of what exactly you were doing at the time. Could you break your usual modesty and explain your contribution to the 2011 revolutions?

As a journalist and blogger, I (together with a growing army of dissident bloggers) helped disseminate the news, photos and videos of the uprising to the widest audience possible, both in Egypt and outside. I was one of the spokespersons for the Egyptian opposition, regularly updating the international media with what was happening on the ground. And I was honored to be part of the political leadership of the Egyptian Revolutionary Socialists Organization throughout the uprising, the coup, and the aftermath.

Most media reports speak of the 2011 uprisings as some incomprehensible event that came out of nowhere. In contrast, you have written about the previous 10 years of victories and defeats which made the fall of Mubarak possible. Could you explain a little?

As a media activist I felt bitter for years prior to the revolution, as the international media coverage of Egypt was largely interested in archeological findings, Red Sea tourism, and most atrociously on how “moderate” Mubarak’s regime was since it was pro-US. Mubarak was glorified as a “secular” leader who is a key to “regional stability” against “Islamist terrorists.”

International media either neglected, or at least did not give enough attention to, the dissent that had been slowly brewing since the outbreak of the second Palestinian intifada in 2000. This was an earthquake that shook the entire region, and in Egypt it triggered the revival of street politics. There is a long chain of events linking 2000 to 2011, passing through milestones like the mini-uprising in Tahrir in 2003, the rise of the pro-democracy movement Kefaya movement in 2004 to 2006, and last but not least the strike wave that shook every single sector of the economy. The 2011 uprising was the product of this decade, and thanks to this long, painful process of dissent accumulation among a population whose internet access was limited to ,roughly 21% on the eve of the revolt. To dub it as a “Facebook Revolution”–no matter how well intentioned–is wrong.

The other common report of 2011 is that it was a “facebook revolution”. In a recent article, you’ve questioned this analysis, while talking about the strategy used by the Egyptian bloggers in pursuit of starting the domino effect. Would you like to elaborate?

The Egyptian revolutionary left had long adopted the use of visuals as a propaganda and agitation tool, in pursuit of the ,domino effect. I invite your readers to check out ,the article for a detailed explanation. But the essence of my argument could be summed up briefly as follows: Unless one is directly linked to the ruling class and thus has a direct interest in maintaining the status quo, most of those “ordinary citizens” who are not engaged in resisting the regime need a catalyst to encourage them into action. And usually that catalyst could be the visual information disseminated as widely as possible about some people somewhere who are resisting the status quo. People can draw parallels most of the time and this can set the domino effect into action.

You’ve stressed that your work was made easier by your membership of the Egyptian Revolutionary Socialists. Can you explain what you mean and how #Revsoc is doing now?

I joined the Egyptian #RevSoc in the late 1990s and have been a member since then. This meant I was part of the organizing efforts on the ground, and in constant contact with some of the key players in Egypt’s labor movement and the dissent scene in general. My vision of instigating this domino effect by spreading visuals of dissent would not have been possible to become a reality, if it wasn’t for the support I received from my comrades.

The #RevSoc, like all other dissident organizations, has been facing enormous difficulties after the coup and the defeat of the revolution. The problem is not only the security crackdowns, arrests and constant surveillance. It’s the wider demoralization among the ranks of revolutionaries and ordinary citizens, which make the attempts of re-organizing sounds like a rosy dream. Spontaneous protests and labor strikes still happen every now and then, as well as rioting related to gentrification issues mainly. But usually they are unsustainable protests that you can build little on.

The #RevSoc still maintains some organizational presence in the capital and some provinces, but we are under siege, like the rest of the opposition, and there is very little room for public organizing. But at least we haven’t dissolved ourselves like other groups، or sold out with a deal with the regime. We might be small now, compared to our pre-2013 size and influence, yet we are now more experienced, with different generations in the movement. We continue to put out regular analysis and theoretical production via our ,site and social media platforms, and when the tide changes in the future, we will be ready.

Much of the Egyptian 2011 generation like yourself has been forced into exile. What does this mean for the possibilities for left wing agitation in Egypt today?

Public agitation in Egypt is currently very risky and virtually banned. Despite the continuous cyber-crackdowns, online agitation and propaganda are still a feasible alternative. The exiles’ networks that are emerging are making good use of the different social media platforms, in my view.

You’ve now been living in Germany for a couple of years. How are politics different here than in Egypt? What have you been able to achieve, and what has been difficult?

The margin of freedoms and civil liberties in Germany is obviously much bigger than that of Egypt, where all shades of dissent are criminalized. Being a liberal democracy, there is naturally more attention here in Germany for electoral politics, parliamentarism and fights over legal reforms, as the dominant form of politics–Something I’m not used to in Egypt, where I spend virtually all my life under emergency law (martial law).

One thing that shocked me is how “apolitical” trade unions here in Germany, compared to the ones in Britain, or compared to the independent trade unions in Egypt prior to the coup. I mean here in terms of international solidarity work on behalf of political detainees or causes related to political oppression.

Another shock was the twisted politics of the German left regarding Palestine. A dominant discourse here in Germany somehow has accommodated progressive politics with the support of a classic form of settler colonialism. The end result is censoring Palestine solidarity and fanatically loyal support for Israel. That’s definitely something I haven’t seen before, in Egypt or elsewhere.

I’m not trying to be dismissive in my remarks. I appreciate many of the genuine struggles the German reformist and radical left were involved in, related to refugees, anti-militarism, climate change, anti-fascism, and housing rights. I just feel this isn’t enough and more is needed.

What is the best way in which people in the Global North can support the struggles in Egypt and make your fight our fight?

Pressure your governments into ceasing the arms exports and security cooperation with the Egyptian and autocratic regimes.

Help spread the word about the abuses of the Egyptian regime, and actively lobby for the release of the detainees.

And last but not least: Get active locally. It’s a global system of oppression, and we need to bring it down, in Cairo or Berlin.

News from Berlin and Germany: 20 February, 2021

Weekly news roundup from Berlin and Germany


Compiled by Ana Ferreira

 

NEWS FROM BERLIN

Fourth corpse found in Landwehr canal since 2015. Are these racist murders?

On 20 December 2020, the lifeless body of Pape Gorgui Samba Diop was discovered. He was floating in the water near the Schlesische Brücke. For the investigating authorities, a suicide. However, an initiative has now launched an appeal for witnesses in the hope of finding out more about the circumstances of Pope’s death once this is not the first corpse found on the Landwehr Canal. He is actually now the fourth person of colour to be found here since 2015, all of whom died in unexplained circumstances, without a fuss. There is a growing sense of unease and fear in the community. Source: tip

Suspected torturer living in Berlin

An official of the Argentine military junta lives unmolested in Berlin. Activists are now protesting in his neighbourhood. The German-Argentinean Luis Esteban Kyburg has lived here for seven years. The ex-military man is considered an urgent suspect for the torture and murder of opposition members during the dictatorship. He is wanted on an international arrest warrant. The Berlin public prosecutor’s office has been investigating the case since 2015. This is also important to mention, as Kyburg is not an isolated case: the German-Chilean ex-officer Walther Klug Rivera, who was legally convicted of multiple murders in Chile, lived unmolested in the Rhineland for four years. Source: taz

Extra buses and trams commissioned to fight Covid

To ensure more distance between passengers on heavily used lines, up to 100 additional buses have been running on Berlin’s roads since Monday, most of them articulated buses. These will be deployed on about 50 particularly heavily used lines. In addition, eight tram trains will be added to provide extra capacity on the busy M5 and M8/18 lines. The updated timetables are available in the VBB-Fahrinfo, where they are marked as additional journeys. However, because almost all pupils are still studying at home, the planned deployment of security guards will be postponed, according to the Berlin Transport Authority (BVG). Source: rbb

“Rigaer 94” suspicious of inspection

The Berlin police must grant protection to an expert fire protection test engineer during his inspection of the house project “Rigaer 94”. This was decided by the Berlin Administrative Court in summary proceedings on Thursday. In January, Interior Senator Andreas Geisel (SPD), in his function as district supervisor, forced Friedrichshain-Kreuzberg to enforce fire protection. The “farce of fire protection” serves “our opponents only as another attempt to attack our house”, says a statement by supporters of “Rigaer 94” published on the internet. They state two fire inspections without police escort “ironically found deficiencies caused by the cops themselves”. Source: nd

NEWS FROM GERMANY

Majority is not working at home

“Home office” is the magic word of the workplace pandemic. But still most people do not work from home. According to a survey from Hans Böckler Foundation, only 24% of employees currently work mainly or exclusively in a home office. This is about 3% less than during the first lockdown just under a year ago. Still, it is slightly more than in November, when only 14% of employees worked from home. This also emerges from estimates by other research institutes such as the German Institute for Economic Research, which already came to the conclusion five years ago that home-based work would theoretically be possible in 40% of jobs. Source: nd

Astra-Zeneca’s vaccine faces criticism, WHO defends it

Side effects of the Corona vaccination of the pharmaceutical company Astra-Zeneca occur in isolated cases more frequently than previously stated by the manufacturer. According to various media reports, there were sickness-related absences after vaccination among at least 21 emergency service workers in the district of Minden-Lübbecke in North Rhine-Westphalia. As a result of such reports, vaccination beneficiaries in the state had already cancelled their immunisation appointments. Meanwhile, Berlin’s health senator Dilek Kalayci (SPD) clarified that there is no freedom of choice in vaccines for under-80s in the capital after all. In Berlin, only people over 80 could choose a vaccination centre. Source: nd

Students face Islamophobia after meeting CDU deputy

Muslim students, beneficiaries of the Avicenna Studienwerk, say they became the targets of a vicious online campaign after a digital meeting with the high-ranking Christian Democrat Norbert Röttgen, who posted a picture showing 25 young people, some wearing headscarves. Some of the fellow students asked Röttgen to obscure the names of the participants. He then deleted any posts that allowed the students to be identified. A new law on hate speech is planned and the German government took the issue to the highest political level with its Cabinet committee on right-wing extremism and racism. Source: dw

Kunduz bombing night: limits of EU justice

Lawyers and opposition representatives have criticised the ruling from last Tuesday of the European Court of Human Rights (ECHR) on the German investigation after a deadly air raid in Kunduz, Afghanistan, eleven years ago. The bombing was ordered by a Bundeswehr colonel, although civilian casualties were likely. After the ruling, representatives of the victims of the bombing also pointed out the legal consequences of the judge’s decision: German courts would henceforth be obliged to investigate alleged war crimes committed by Bundeswehr soldiers abroad. The applicants are still hoping for an apology from Germany. Source: heise

“Institutions alone will not be the engine of change”

After the elections – Interview with socialists from Catalonia


Interview with Fer Cornella (FC), David Karvala (DK)

NOTE: at the bottom of this article there is a Glossary of the different parties mentioned in the interview

 

Thanks to both of you for agreeing to talk to us. Can you start by saying who you voted for and why?

FC: I voted for the CUP-G. It is the only party capable of ending the process of national and social emancipation that Catalonia began 10 years ago. Without a strong and decisive CUP, neither Catalonia nor the rest of Spain can advance at a social, economic and ecological level.

DK: I don’t have a vote, because I have a British passport although I’ve been living here for nearly 30 years. If I had a vote I would have voted for CUP as the anti-capitalist option committed to social struggles, although there are some issues that I don’t agree with. Other possible options would have been and the ERC even Comuns although they would be less interesting.

What do you think that the election results signify?

FC: It reaffirms and strengthens the independence process. It is, therefore, a result that weakens the Regime of 1978 that emerged after 40 years of fascist dictatorship. The independence movement is stronger than ever and has obtained more than 51% of the vote. Moreover, the parliament continues to be increasingly left.

Catalonia is currently in the middle of the third wave of the pandemic, with a risk index higher than 300. Unfortunately, the partisan interests of the PSOE prevailed over general health interests: the polls were so favourable that they did not want to postpone the elections. The far right VOX had already announced that they would make the PSC’s Salvador Illa president in order to expel the pro-independence parties from power.

DK: The mainstream right wing vote for both Ciudadanos (winners of the previous elections). and the PP collapsed. PP has been one of the 2 leading parties of the Spanish state for the last 40 years is now on the point of disappearing with just 3 MPs in a parliament of 135.

For the first time. the pro-independence parties got an overall majority of votes, not just of seats. There is also the strong and dangerous entry of the far right VOX with 11 MPs. The PSC won a majority, winning a lot of seats back from Ciudadanos but will be unlikely to be able to form a government.

The election saw rival left candidatures, most notably from the CUP and Comuns. Was it not possible to have a single left slate? And if not, why not?

DK: A single left slate wasn’t possible. The clearest problem to a joint slate is the national question. The Comuns try to avoid it. Formally they do support the right to self determination and amnesty but they’re mainly against independence.

Another problem we have to say is that the CUP is anti-capitalist, pro-independence and has lots of good people in it but also has problems with sectarianism. Possible initiatives that could be taken to try and overcome the problems and win people from Comuns to more firmly support the right to self-determination are not taken. Unity is possible in social struggles but in terms of a single electoral slate I don’t think its on the cards right now.

FC: I wish we had had an even bigger left front. However, it is true that it is not easy. Unfortunately, Unidas Podemos, at the state level has decided to support Sánchez’s PSOE government. Podemos was born in 2014 to put an end to both regime’s parties – the so called PPSOE (PP and PSOE)- but has ended up giving oxygen to the regime of 78.

In Catalonia, they wanted to repeat this same recipe, forming a coalition between En Comú Podem, PSC, and adding the ERC. For the CUP there is a no-go to pact with the PSOE, a party that is part of the so-called bloc of the §155. PSOE, PP, Ciudadanos and VOX all support the Crown and were responsible or in favour of suspending the self-government of Catalonia after the referendum in 2017. After this referendum, the main PSC candidate, Salvador Illa, had no problem participating in a unionist demonstration, taking a picture with the right and the fascists of VOX. The unity of Spain is above all. As a left party, we cannot support this.

At the local level, the Comuns have one face, but at the regional level another. Ada Colau is not a bad mayor of Barcelona and she is doing things well. However, at the regional and state level unfortunately it is something else. The Comuns still carry a large part of the old ICV. Until 2006, ICV member Joan Saura was Interior Minister in a coalition government. Repression against the social movements, squatters and anarchists was stronger than ever. For the social movements, neighbourhood organisations and the left, that coalition left no good memories. We as CUP could never tolerate such repression because we are closely linked to these movements, we come from these movements and we are these movements.

What is the current news about Catalonian political prisoners in the Spanish State?

DK: The nine imprisoned political leaders were allowed out for week-ends just before the election campaign started. This helped to calm things down politically, which benefited the PSC in the Catalan elections. Its a scandal that they’re in prison. The court that tried them is an inheritance from Franco. The Spanish government should declare an amnesty.

They’re trying to get them to ask for a pardon which would involve them saying “Yes, we were wrong, we shouldn’t have done it and we’re very sorry, basically for defending democracy, but the prisoners are refusing to do that.”

FC: Once the election results in Catalonia were known, the Attorney General called for an end to the semi-liberty which had been temporarily granted to the political prisoners. They have already spent more time in prison under the PSOE-Podemos government than under right-wing governments. Even Pablo Iglesias admitted recently that there is not a situation of full political and democratic normality in Spain.

How do you deal with the right wing of the Independence movement in Catalonia and elsewhere? Can you be sure that left wing demands would be implemented after independence?

FC: More than 40 laws approved by the Parliament of Catalonia in recent legislatures have been systematically nullified by the Spanish judicial system. These include the “energy poverty” law, to prevent energy companies from cutting off electricity to the poorest households, the “Nuclear Energy” law, which established a plan to close nuclear power plants in Catalonia, the law prohibiting fracking, the law against evictions, and the law of equality between men and women, etc.

On an international level, the pacifist movement is deeply rooted in Catalonia. For example, the demonstrations against the Iraq war in Barcelona in 2003 were among the largest ones in Europe and gathered more than a million people in the streets. We must not forget the referendum on NATO in 1984, in which in Catalonia the “No” vote won. Last but not least, there was a successful pacifist movement during the 1990s against the mandatory military service. There would be great possibilities for Catalonia to play a role of stability and peace in Europe.

DK: You have to distinguish between the tiny far right section, the Catalan National Front that made a lot of noise, managed to collect the signatures to be able to stand in the elections, and they got less then 5,000 votes out of 5 million potential voters, so if anyone tries to say that the bulk of the independence movement is far right, is just wrong.

With the experience of 2017 it should be clear that its very unlikely that we can get independence just by a formal agreement and constitutional reorganisation from above that just gives us the right to self-determination and a vote in which independence wins. This involves much more social struggle, and not just symbolic protests at the airport and a few containers being burnt.

It requires the active involvement of the working class and the working class is half and half between pro-independence and not at all convinced by independence. To win over the bulk of that working class we need to be much firmer on social change, and not just a few laws that get passed in the Catalan parliament and then get overruled by the constitutional court in Madrid. I mean really linking social demands and putting them into practise through social struggle. In other words a class orientation in terms of fighting for independence.

Both the CUP and Comuns have talked about the possibility of entering a coalition government in Catalonia. What are the advantages and dangers of such coalitions?

DK: The CUP have talked about going into coalition but I think they correctly decided not to. Some of their messages have been unclear, saying well if they agree to this, this and this condition, we might enter, but as I understand it, that’s part of an internal discussion and they’re conditions that won’t be fulfilled anyway. I think it would be a big mistake for the CUP to go into government. They’re already too involved in institutional politics at a cost of their presence on the street.

I mean they do have activists on the street. In the last few days in the protests against Pablo Hasel being imprisoned there’ve been lots of CUP members there, but in terms of the orientation of the party as a whole, its shifted strongly to their participation in the institutions. They have 300 councillors across Catalunya, which from a small party of maybe 2,000 people means that maybe half of their members are directly working in institutional politics, and entering a coalition government would make that even worse.

FC: The CUP-G has said it would be willing to enter a progressive government that advances the independence process and that stands for a referendum and an amnesty. The CUP see this as the only possibility for social, ecological and economic progress.

A coalition with the PSC would be currently a big mistake. At the European level, social democracy is finally reaping the fruits of neo-liberal policies and social cuts that they have been practising for decades. And in both France and Germany, for example, they have suffered well-deserved falls. It is not the task of the left to rescue the PSOE/PSC now. Again, it is time to overcome the Regime of the 78. There is enough force for this and all left forces should work in this direction.

Last week, Nazis organised a pogrom against refugees on the Canary Islands. This week, 300 Nazis marched in Madrid. And now the Francoist VOX party is in the Catalan parliament for the first time ever, and had a better result in the election than expected. How great is the far right threat? And what is being done to stop it?

FC: The absolute lack of overcoming the Franco dictatorship is the main problem facing Spain with the far right. Recently, a letter has been discovered addressed to the king and signed by 73 former commanders of the Spanish army, calling the current Spanish government a “social communist government endorsed by pro-terrorist and pro-independence activists”. Spain has a structural problem with fascism and far right.

At the same time, the rapper Pablo Hasel was sent to prison this week for a song in which he criticized the monarchy. According to a recent Spanish newspaper, since the 1990s around 150 artists, journalists, politicians and singers have been convicted in Spain for crimes of opinion. Obviously all kinds of coalitions and platforms against the far right and against racism are strongly needed in order to face this fascism supported and allowed by the State.

DK: In Catalunya we’ve got a solid movement that obviously needs strengthening but to give an idea, in the weeks running up to election we had protests against VOX, actions in dozens of cities with our materials of Stop VOX, stickers all over the place. Some of those were directly organised by the local groups of Unite against Fascism and Racism other were organized by Antifa groups or radical left groups, but within the framework of Stop VOX.

There’s a desperate need both to strengthen United against Fascism in Catalunya, because there’s the shock of VOX having entered, but also and even more urgently in places like Madrid or Murcia, which is just between Valencia and Andalucia, where VOX is the most voted party, so its a serious issue. The small Antifa groups do their stuff, but they can’t do what’s necessary to stop something like VOX, so we need something like Unite against Fascism and Racism in more places.

How strong is the Spanish Left? Outside election time, what projects are they involved in? Can you relate any success stories?

FC: The elections in Catalonia have strengthened the left: CUP and ERC have increased the number of deputies. The Comuns, on the other hand, have stagnated. In general, it seems now that Unidas Podemos is not benefiting from its participation in the government. On the other hand, the PSOE seems to be recovering. And that’s not any good news as this party won’t carry out the social and economic emergency policies needed to curb the crisis.

The peculiarity of the CUP is that we define itself as a “municipalist” (local-based) and internationalist party. Our presence in the other institutions, beyond the municipality, is relatively new and, for the time being, temporary. At the local level, in those few places where we govern the experience has been good and we have returned to public management services that had been outsourced such as water, street cleaning, kindergartens or street lighting. Publicly managed recovery of essential and strategic services such as energy is a key pillar of our policy. We have also done a lot of anti-repression work and anti-fascist struggle in the streets.

DK: The PSC still has members on the ground in some places but much reduced. Podemos was launched with massive enthusiasm in 2014, promising to assault the heavens and change everything, but now they’re a leftish reformist party, with institutional politics. They’ve lost most of their base. At best they’re passive supporters, at worst totally disillusioned.

Most of the Spanish left is strongly oriented on elections. Many of them have members involved in different things. I’m sure the Communist Party still have lots of members involved in trade union struggles. But as parties, they’re orientation is very much on the institutions.

We are currently celebrating 10 years of the so-called “Arab Spring” This inspired the occupation of the squares in Spain, the growth of the 15M movement and the foundation of Podemos. What can we learn from the last 10 years?

DK: It was exciting and impressive in 2011. One of the flaws of the 15 May Indignados movement was to miss vital elements particularly of the Egyptian experience. You had Tahrir, but you also had people that went home from Tahrir to their workplaces and massive workers’ struggles – the massive independent workers’ movement that grew up between 2008 and the revolution. Most of the social movement activists and the inheritors of the anti-capitalist movement after Seattle have no real conception of the working class and class struggle.

Even the radical left that does talk about the working class actually doesn’t really have a serious understanding of the working class. It’s more the idea of the working class as heroic self-conscious “I am a worker”, and most working class people aren’t like that. They have their life, their job, their house if they have it and are trying to live their life. The idea of the working class as a real, existing force is very weak, and therefore the idea of working in the main trade unions is not at all strong. For symbolic things like the Squares that’s not a problem, but if you really want to change the world, you need to connect up with the working class and that’s not happened. It didn’t happen with the 15th May movement and its not happened since then.

FC: Institutions alone will not be the engine of change. The presence and strength of social movements in the streets is essential and must remain strong. These 10 years of process in Catalonia have reinforced precisely this: the culture of demonstration and protest in the street has gained a lot of strength and, thus, people have become politicized. There has been a change of culture, an emancipatory process. People have lost their fear of practicing peaceful civil disobedience and fighting for what they believe in. The strong protests and mobilizations that have been generated spontaneously this week in defence of Pablo Hasel, are also another product of this landscape. On the other hand, the repression does not stop but we must overcome it and persist in the mobilizations and the presence of the people in the street. This is all what we have, it is our strength and is the key.

Fer Cornella is of Catalan origin but has been living abroad for about 20 years. He is a member of the Die Linke party in Germany and supports the exteriors section of the CUP.

David Karvala has lived in Catalonia since 1993. He is a member of marx21 in the Spanish state and is one of the spokespeople of Unity Against Fascism and Racism

Glossary of parties

  • Ciudadanos (Cs) – populist Spanish party which is currently moving to the right
  • CUP / CUP-G (Candidatura d’Unitat Popular-Un nou Cilce per Guanyar) – left-wing Catalonian pro independence party/alliance
  • En Comú Podem (ECP) – left-wing Catalonian coalition containing Unidas Podemos and Barcelona En Comú, the party of Ada Colau, Mayor of Barcelona
  • Esquerra Republicana (ERC) – social democratic Catalonian pro-independence party
  • ICV – Left-Green Catalonian party, dissolved in 2019
  • Izquierda Unida (IU) – left wing coalition including the Spanish Communist Party
  • Junts per Catalunya (JxCat) – centre-right Catalonian party
  • Podemos – left wing Spanish party, founded in 2014
  • PP – conservative, Christian Democratic Spanish party
  • PSC – Catalonian sister party of the social democratic PSOE
  • PSOE – social democratic Spanish party
  • Unidas Podemos – left-wing Spanish electoral alliance between IU and Podemos
  • VOX – Far right Spanish party with links to organised Nazis